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25 Oct, 2022
2022-10-25 10:41:09 AM UTC

onthetrail wrote:

remy wrote:

In many ways, I find the facsimile signature more interesting than the proof itself. As far as I know Tolkien only used that signature with family and close friends. So how it ended up being used is quite a mystery.

I really enjoy reading these stories. The sig is a rather wonderful thing. It has been noted by W&C in Chronology 3 February 1964 "Tolkien writes to Ronald Eames, enclosing the proofs of Tree and Leaf. He has made no alterations. He queries the cover/title-page which does not include his tree design. In regard to the facsimile of his signature on the title-page: ‘I do not and never have used the signature “Ronald Tolkien” as a “public” or auctorial signature, and I do not think it suitable for this purpose'"

And Eames replies: 5 February 1964 "Ronald Eames writes to Tolkien. The tree design is intended for the cover of the paperback edition, not the title-page. He hopes to send a proof of the cover soon. He asks Tolkien to supply a more suitable version of his signature for the titlepage."

The above quotes are taken from Christina Scull & Wayne G. Hammond's The J.R.R. Tolkien Companion and Guide: Chronology.

So the sig is really a treasure and never intended by Tolkien for use here. You have a rare treasure remy.

Findegil, I hope the above quotes are acceptable and not too over the line of fair use. Please tell me off if not and I will remove them.

Good catch onthetrail !
So we have the whole story here. This is fascinating.
It reminds me that Christopher Tolkien has 2 different signatures (the type we see on some copies of the first UK edition of the Silmarillion or the '82 Super Deluxe, and the type we used to see afterward on the '98 Super deluxe Silmarillion, '07 and '09 superdeluxes of CoH and TLoS&G).
Now remy I think you could be proud to have 2 types of sig for the son and now the father
For me this facsimile is well worth an original genuine one !
25 Oct, 2022
2022-10-25 1:04:53 PM UTC

Trotter wrote:

I wonder where GA&U obtained the Ronald Tolkien signature, can't see him using that in writing to them.

Did they ask him to supply it for the book, and then he was surprised when it was used in the book?

Tolkien was signing his name "Ronald Tolkien" in letters to Rayner since about 1960; see our article "Names" in the Reader's Guide. It would have been easy to lend an example to the blockmaker to photograph. Allen & Unwin did this with the signature on an autograph note Tolkien sent to his publisher on 14 May 1962, for the "J.R.R. Tolkien" printed under the portrait used in the English and Medieval Studies Festschrift presented to Tolkien that year.

Wayne & Christina
31 Oct, 2022 (edited)
2022-10-31 11:23:52 PM UTC
Many thanks for the information onthetrail & Findegil. Very useful and pretty much completes the story. Fascinating indeed.
8 January (edited)
2024-1-8 8:51:18 AM UTC
I notice a loosely related thing: The Estate registered a different "Ronald Tolkien" signature as trademark in 2004, which is now expired. Was it ever used?

11 January
2024-1-11 1:23:09 AM UTC
An even more loosely related thing:

An interesting 1986 Italian Hobbit. It looks like Bompiani initially published this edition with the authors name as "Ronald Tolkien". This was later corrected.

11_659f422ca53bd.jpg 1483X1978 px

11_659f4236805ef.jpg 1410X1880 px
11 January
2024-1-11 6:34:24 PM UTC
Thank you very much for sharing this remy ! I think this is fascinating and a real piece of collecting. Im glad I could find a copy today. 😊
11 January
2024-1-11 10:26:29 PM UTC

remy wrote:

An even more loosely related thing:

An interesting 1986 Italian Hobbit. It looks like Bompiani initially published this edition with the authors name as "Ronald Tolkien". This was later corrected.

A nice curiosity in Italian collecting. Nice acquisitions, and they seem to be in good condition too, not so obvious as they are school editions.
12 March
2024-3-12 3:19:28 PM UTC
So, another Tree and Leaf proof went up for sale over this past weekend. Luckily the book seller is a 20 minute drive from my house so I stopped by this morning to check it out in person.

Seems that not only is the proof pretty much identical to the one remy posted, it also had an early dustjacket. So, resistance was futile and I bought it. Here are a few pics of the book:


And of the dustjacket:


Comparison of the dustjackets between a final published UK 1964 1st/1st (top) and the proof (bottom)…note the misspelling of Bombadil in the proof:


Interesting the title page is slightly different in the published (first image) compared to the proof (second image):


And also the published book has several final pages of adverts (first image) but none in the proof (second image):


And a size comparison:

5090_65f06f9fbbc7a.jpeg 4032X3024 px
12 March
2024-3-12 3:36:57 PM UTC
Looks great! Fantastic addition to your collection LanceFormation
12 March
2024-3-12 3:57:59 PM UTC
Congratulations! And seems to be in excellent condition too!
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